When metal music meets jazz/fusion, talent and lots of experimentation plus improvisation then the final outcome cannot be less than interesting. That’s exactly what Exivious have done on their second release. Tymon Kruidenier, the guitarist, songwriter & producer of the band had a chat with Grande Rock about the newest album, music & various other attention-grabbing things…
Hi Tymon… well, 4 years after your debut, it was time to come back with a new album. Did you feel that the time was right?
T: We actually would have done it a lot sooner if it weren’t for me and Robin playing in Cynic until 2011. When we quit Cynic and moved back to the Netherlands, it was a logical step for Exivious to start working on a new album. Having said that, it was probably for the better to have some years in between. To get a fresh perspective on things.
By the way, how had the response for your debut album been? Did it give you the courage to go on?
T: It was so much better than we expected. We always thought our music, especially our debut, would be much more of a niche thing. Seeing as it’s pretty busy at times and incorporates quite a lot of jazz/fusion influences. But it seems the metal scene has really opened up to new influences and sounds these past couple of years.
Hence, what has changed in “Liminal” in comparison to your debut?
T: I think it’s an overall easier and more pleasant listening (and playing) experience. There’s stronger dynamics, better song structures and a much more natural flow present. There’s less emphasis on the technical aspect, as we didn’t feel like we had anything to prove this time around. We really focused on writing good songs, that came first. And there’s some strong post-rock influences present as well on “Liminal”, we really dig that genre!
Why did you name the album “Liminal”? Is it due to the nature of your music or what?
T: It’s all tied to the concept of liminality. It describes the stage in a transformation where the state of origin is being dissolved and reconstruction into its new state can begin. We felt that’s very much how the music on “Liminal” came to be and it’s also the concept we used for the artwork. For a title however, we thought it’s more fitting to go for liminal, as it seems to address the state of transformation a little better. What’s also interesting is that it’s actually not an existing word, like our band name.
I’ve read that you did a crowd-funding campaign for the “Liminal” and by the end of the campaign the amount collected was more than double the goal! That’s a great goal to achieve. Especially nowadays when many bands try such a thing but only a few succeed. Were you afraid at some point or not?
T: Yeah, what a great concept! Especially if you have such a loyal following as we do. We didn't really know what to expect, so we kept the goal as low as possible. Just enough for us to invest in some new gear, cover studio costs and put food in our mouth while recording and mixing the album. Of course we were a little nervous before starting the campaign. But once we did, it went so fast that we didn’t have any time to be afraid, fortunately! (i.n.: Sure, it’s a blessing to have so many loyal fans…)
Was it afterwards that you cooperated with Season of Mist? Having in mind that the actual goal has been reached, the label can only help in terms of distribution and advertising… right?
T: Yeah, it was something we were open about from the beginning. If the deal would be right, we would sign with a label. And you’re completely correct, the reasons we went with a label were distribution and promotion only. People don’t seem to realize that you make a lot less money on CD sales when you’re signed to a label. So financially, it was actually a big investment for the band to get signed.
Do you think that’s the future of music? Fans funding their beloved bands and so on?
T: I think and hope so! The give-and-take principle of crowd-funding is something really awesome to me. We always try and have the best possible relationship with our listeners by interacting with them, involving them in decisions and just trying to make them feel like they’re part of the complete picture, which they are! And a concept like crowd-funding just fits perfectly in that philosophy.
You also did the production, the mixing and the mastering (along with Joris Bonis) of the album. I bet you had in mind the kind of sound you wanted to achieve since day one. So, are you satisfied by the final result? Was the debut’s production the benchmark for the new album’s overall sound?
T: Yeah I’m happy! It sounds exactly how I wanted it to sound, more honest and pure and to the point. There’s no 80s clean guitars anymore, no fake reverb on the drums, no synthesizers. And I think it makes the album sound rawer, more open, more dynamic and more in your face. But I wouldn’t be the perfectionist I am if I didn’t see some room for improvement for the next album already. Already looking forward to recording the next one! (i.n.: I bet you do!)
There’s also a new drummer on board, Yuma van Eekelen (Brutus, The New Dominion, ex-Pestilence). How did that occur? Do you think that his dynamic yet technical playing added to the final sound?
T: Our previous drummer, Stef Broks, basically didn’t have the time to be a full time member. He’s really busy with his band Textures and other commitments. Yuma was a very logical choice for us because he’s been a longtime friend of the band and is a great drummer. His background is, like ours, in extreme metal and that’s where he was really skilled. But he’s a bit younger and wasn’t completely ready to play our kind of music when we first recruited him. So we spent some months training him, looking for his jazz/fusion sound, bringing out the dynamics and flow we needed. We are lucky he’s an incredibly fast learner and in the end, he completely blew away all expectations we had.
What about the two guest appearances? Jonas Knutsson (Fredrik Thordendal’s Special Defects) on saxophone & Manfred Dikkers (At War with Self, The Kolios Project) on percussion. I’m sure that a saxman is always needed in this kind music. You have also cooperated with Manfred on the first album, right?
T: When we were thinking of having guest appearances on the album, we quickly realized we wouldn’t want other guitar players on there. There’s plenty of guitars on the album already. So when we started thinking of other instruments, we almost immediately thought of Jonas, who recorded one of our all-time favorite solos ever on Fredrik’s Special Defects album. The section in “Deeply Woven” also just seemed so right to us and he did such a fantastic job! Couldn’t be happier with it!
Manfred has been a longtime friend of the band as well. He’s a great drummer but also a great percussionist. At this point, he kind of became our go-to percussionist whenever we need percussion. It’s actually funny how it happened this time around. Michel told me he would love some ocean-like sounds on the outro of “Movement”. When I sent the track to Manfred for percussion, the first thing he did was record ocean-drum without me telling him Michel’s idea. It’s this big, flat drum that sounds almost identical to the sea washing up on shore.
“Liminal” is a complex, thought-provoking album which needs several listens & concentration. Do you think that people in our time have the time to do so? Especially now, that technology has made things very easy & fast.
T: Interesting question! Our kind of music definitely doesn’t fit in the consumption based world we live in these days. However, I suspect this phenomenon, like all phenomena, has its opposite and contrasting sets of qualities, properties or powers as well. So an album like this might actually be a breeze of fresh air for a lot of people.
Thus what is the best way to describe Exivious’ music?
T: That’s really not for me to say. I’m too involved to have an opinion about that. What we’re striving for however, is creating music that’s original, carries a lot of emotion, is artistically relevant, but doesn’t come across as pretentious. But I’m sure the average listener would give you a very different answer. (i.n.: No doubt about it!)
Once again you cooperated with Henrik van Leeuwen for the album’s artwork. You are fond of this psychedelic/minimalist art, isn’t it so?
T: We love his work. It’s not just the graphic side of things, he’s also a big part of coming up with the concepts for the artwork. He’s another longtime friend and has actually been my sister’s boyfriend for many years. His own work is even more minimal than what he does for us. We’re always pushing him to make things look a little more psychedelic to fit our music.
T: We actually would have done it a lot sooner if it weren’t for me and Robin playing in Cynic until 2011. When we quit Cynic and moved back to the Netherlands, it was a logical step for Exivious to start working on a new album. Having said that, it was probably for the better to have some years in between. To get a fresh perspective on things.
By the way, how had the response for your debut album been? Did it give you the courage to go on?
T: It was so much better than we expected. We always thought our music, especially our debut, would be much more of a niche thing. Seeing as it’s pretty busy at times and incorporates quite a lot of jazz/fusion influences. But it seems the metal scene has really opened up to new influences and sounds these past couple of years.
Hence, what has changed in “Liminal” in comparison to your debut?
T: I think it’s an overall easier and more pleasant listening (and playing) experience. There’s stronger dynamics, better song structures and a much more natural flow present. There’s less emphasis on the technical aspect, as we didn’t feel like we had anything to prove this time around. We really focused on writing good songs, that came first. And there’s some strong post-rock influences present as well on “Liminal”, we really dig that genre!
Why did you name the album “Liminal”? Is it due to the nature of your music or what?
T: It’s all tied to the concept of liminality. It describes the stage in a transformation where the state of origin is being dissolved and reconstruction into its new state can begin. We felt that’s very much how the music on “Liminal” came to be and it’s also the concept we used for the artwork. For a title however, we thought it’s more fitting to go for liminal, as it seems to address the state of transformation a little better. What’s also interesting is that it’s actually not an existing word, like our band name.
I’ve read that you did a crowd-funding campaign for the “Liminal” and by the end of the campaign the amount collected was more than double the goal! That’s a great goal to achieve. Especially nowadays when many bands try such a thing but only a few succeed. Were you afraid at some point or not?
T: Yeah, what a great concept! Especially if you have such a loyal following as we do. We didn't really know what to expect, so we kept the goal as low as possible. Just enough for us to invest in some new gear, cover studio costs and put food in our mouth while recording and mixing the album. Of course we were a little nervous before starting the campaign. But once we did, it went so fast that we didn’t have any time to be afraid, fortunately! (i.n.: Sure, it’s a blessing to have so many loyal fans…)
Was it afterwards that you cooperated with Season of Mist? Having in mind that the actual goal has been reached, the label can only help in terms of distribution and advertising… right?
T: Yeah, it was something we were open about from the beginning. If the deal would be right, we would sign with a label. And you’re completely correct, the reasons we went with a label were distribution and promotion only. People don’t seem to realize that you make a lot less money on CD sales when you’re signed to a label. So financially, it was actually a big investment for the band to get signed.
Do you think that’s the future of music? Fans funding their beloved bands and so on?
T: I think and hope so! The give-and-take principle of crowd-funding is something really awesome to me. We always try and have the best possible relationship with our listeners by interacting with them, involving them in decisions and just trying to make them feel like they’re part of the complete picture, which they are! And a concept like crowd-funding just fits perfectly in that philosophy.
You also did the production, the mixing and the mastering (along with Joris Bonis) of the album. I bet you had in mind the kind of sound you wanted to achieve since day one. So, are you satisfied by the final result? Was the debut’s production the benchmark for the new album’s overall sound?
T: Yeah I’m happy! It sounds exactly how I wanted it to sound, more honest and pure and to the point. There’s no 80s clean guitars anymore, no fake reverb on the drums, no synthesizers. And I think it makes the album sound rawer, more open, more dynamic and more in your face. But I wouldn’t be the perfectionist I am if I didn’t see some room for improvement for the next album already. Already looking forward to recording the next one! (i.n.: I bet you do!)
There’s also a new drummer on board, Yuma van Eekelen (Brutus, The New Dominion, ex-Pestilence). How did that occur? Do you think that his dynamic yet technical playing added to the final sound?
T: Our previous drummer, Stef Broks, basically didn’t have the time to be a full time member. He’s really busy with his band Textures and other commitments. Yuma was a very logical choice for us because he’s been a longtime friend of the band and is a great drummer. His background is, like ours, in extreme metal and that’s where he was really skilled. But he’s a bit younger and wasn’t completely ready to play our kind of music when we first recruited him. So we spent some months training him, looking for his jazz/fusion sound, bringing out the dynamics and flow we needed. We are lucky he’s an incredibly fast learner and in the end, he completely blew away all expectations we had.
What about the two guest appearances? Jonas Knutsson (Fredrik Thordendal’s Special Defects) on saxophone & Manfred Dikkers (At War with Self, The Kolios Project) on percussion. I’m sure that a saxman is always needed in this kind music. You have also cooperated with Manfred on the first album, right?
T: When we were thinking of having guest appearances on the album, we quickly realized we wouldn’t want other guitar players on there. There’s plenty of guitars on the album already. So when we started thinking of other instruments, we almost immediately thought of Jonas, who recorded one of our all-time favorite solos ever on Fredrik’s Special Defects album. The section in “Deeply Woven” also just seemed so right to us and he did such a fantastic job! Couldn’t be happier with it!
Manfred has been a longtime friend of the band as well. He’s a great drummer but also a great percussionist. At this point, he kind of became our go-to percussionist whenever we need percussion. It’s actually funny how it happened this time around. Michel told me he would love some ocean-like sounds on the outro of “Movement”. When I sent the track to Manfred for percussion, the first thing he did was record ocean-drum without me telling him Michel’s idea. It’s this big, flat drum that sounds almost identical to the sea washing up on shore.
“Liminal” is a complex, thought-provoking album which needs several listens & concentration. Do you think that people in our time have the time to do so? Especially now, that technology has made things very easy & fast.
T: Interesting question! Our kind of music definitely doesn’t fit in the consumption based world we live in these days. However, I suspect this phenomenon, like all phenomena, has its opposite and contrasting sets of qualities, properties or powers as well. So an album like this might actually be a breeze of fresh air for a lot of people.
Thus what is the best way to describe Exivious’ music?
T: That’s really not for me to say. I’m too involved to have an opinion about that. What we’re striving for however, is creating music that’s original, carries a lot of emotion, is artistically relevant, but doesn’t come across as pretentious. But I’m sure the average listener would give you a very different answer. (i.n.: No doubt about it!)
Once again you cooperated with Henrik van Leeuwen for the album’s artwork. You are fond of this psychedelic/minimalist art, isn’t it so?
T: We love his work. It’s not just the graphic side of things, he’s also a big part of coming up with the concepts for the artwork. He’s another longtime friend and has actually been my sister’s boyfriend for many years. His own work is even more minimal than what he does for us. We’re always pushing him to make things look a little more psychedelic to fit our music.
What are the band’s future plans? Any live shows booked yet? Summer festivals?
T: Touring! We’re looking for bands to support right now. Some festivals are in the pipeline, so let’s hope it will work out!
Why did Robin (bass) & you leave Cynic? Was it due to uncertain circumstances or what? Do you regret it or it’s better that you have taken your own way?
T: To make a long story short, I guess we just didn’t really fit into that band. At least, not in the current format and the direction they’re going in. And I needed the freedom! To do exactly what I want to do, music wise and business wise. And to do all of this with 3 great and like-minded friends who happen to be great musicians. Don’t get me wrong, I’m very grateful for my time with Cynic. I gained tons of experience and had so much fun. But having said that; I’m a bad follower. I always have a clear idea on how to do things and on how to improve things. That wasn’t my place in Cynic. With Exivious we’re all on the same page, we share similar goals, similar tastes in music and we’re just great friends. So I don’t regret leaving Cynic at all, and I’m sure Robin feels the same way.
I think it’s time for our weird questions!!! How did you come up with the name Exivious for that band?
T: It’s a little embarrassing to explain, but my excuse is that I came up with it when I was 17 years old. Exivious doesn’t mean anything, it just popped into my head during an English lesson at school. We debated changing the name, back when we released our first album. But we figured we already build up a bit of a name in the underground scene, so we decided to stick with it. An added bonus though, is that it’s very easy to look us up on the internet. Literally all hits on a Google search for Exivious are related to the band… haha…
What do you think about that digital/downloading trend of our time? What’s there for a band when most people are downloading their albums and do not even care to listen to them most of the times? What shall change so as to make it through?
T: It’s just how things are at the moment, not much we artists can do about it except for going with the flow and finding other ways to generate some income. The way most bands solve this problem is by touring a lot and hoping to sell some merchandise. But having said that, there are fortunately still quite a lot of people out there who buy music, be it in digital form or on CD. I’m guessing it’s becoming more of a general knowledge kind of thing how small bands operate and make money. I think this is great because it encourages people to buy their favorite band’s albums just out of support for the band.
What’s more enjoyable… producing, playing or writing music?
T: It’s all equally enjoyable to me, especially because it’s not just one of these things full time. I’m one of those persons who could never ever have the same full time job for 10 years, hell even 1 year would be too much. So having the variety of all these different jobs is an incredible luxury. The most rewarding however, is writing music. Nothing beats the feeling of creation.
Which is the record you wish you had written and why?
T: The latest Exivious album. Not because I think it’s so great, but because that’s where I’m at in my life. I worked very hard to get to this point and it’s exactly where I’m supposed to be. It would be meaningless to having written the greatest album I know, because it would simply not be me. Unless of course, you would assume I would also have the mind, the ambitions, the training and everything the artist in question has. But at that point, I would probably have a different opinion on what the greatest record of all time is anyways. Hard question to answer!
Were you obliged to give just one album to extraterrestrials that would represent the whole human music, which album would it be and from which band/artist?
T: Depends whether they from a threat or not. If so, I would give them Decapitated’s “Organic Hallucinosis”, just so they know not to fuck with us humans. But if they would be a peaceful species who I’d want to impress, I’d probably give them “Suite Begamasque” by Claude Debussy.
Imagine that your girlfriend is selling your whole album-collection just to buy an expensive ring for herself. How would you react?
T: If I ever manage to get a girlfriend like that, then shame on me! Having said that, my album-collection is not that impressive anyways… haha…
I think we’re done Tymon… Close this interview in your way… Take care!
T: Thanks for the support and the interesting questions! And to everyone reading this, hope to see you guys out on the road soon. Cheers!
T: Touring! We’re looking for bands to support right now. Some festivals are in the pipeline, so let’s hope it will work out!
Why did Robin (bass) & you leave Cynic? Was it due to uncertain circumstances or what? Do you regret it or it’s better that you have taken your own way?
T: To make a long story short, I guess we just didn’t really fit into that band. At least, not in the current format and the direction they’re going in. And I needed the freedom! To do exactly what I want to do, music wise and business wise. And to do all of this with 3 great and like-minded friends who happen to be great musicians. Don’t get me wrong, I’m very grateful for my time with Cynic. I gained tons of experience and had so much fun. But having said that; I’m a bad follower. I always have a clear idea on how to do things and on how to improve things. That wasn’t my place in Cynic. With Exivious we’re all on the same page, we share similar goals, similar tastes in music and we’re just great friends. So I don’t regret leaving Cynic at all, and I’m sure Robin feels the same way.
I think it’s time for our weird questions!!! How did you come up with the name Exivious for that band?
T: It’s a little embarrassing to explain, but my excuse is that I came up with it when I was 17 years old. Exivious doesn’t mean anything, it just popped into my head during an English lesson at school. We debated changing the name, back when we released our first album. But we figured we already build up a bit of a name in the underground scene, so we decided to stick with it. An added bonus though, is that it’s very easy to look us up on the internet. Literally all hits on a Google search for Exivious are related to the band… haha…
What do you think about that digital/downloading trend of our time? What’s there for a band when most people are downloading their albums and do not even care to listen to them most of the times? What shall change so as to make it through?
T: It’s just how things are at the moment, not much we artists can do about it except for going with the flow and finding other ways to generate some income. The way most bands solve this problem is by touring a lot and hoping to sell some merchandise. But having said that, there are fortunately still quite a lot of people out there who buy music, be it in digital form or on CD. I’m guessing it’s becoming more of a general knowledge kind of thing how small bands operate and make money. I think this is great because it encourages people to buy their favorite band’s albums just out of support for the band.
What’s more enjoyable… producing, playing or writing music?
T: It’s all equally enjoyable to me, especially because it’s not just one of these things full time. I’m one of those persons who could never ever have the same full time job for 10 years, hell even 1 year would be too much. So having the variety of all these different jobs is an incredible luxury. The most rewarding however, is writing music. Nothing beats the feeling of creation.
Which is the record you wish you had written and why?
T: The latest Exivious album. Not because I think it’s so great, but because that’s where I’m at in my life. I worked very hard to get to this point and it’s exactly where I’m supposed to be. It would be meaningless to having written the greatest album I know, because it would simply not be me. Unless of course, you would assume I would also have the mind, the ambitions, the training and everything the artist in question has. But at that point, I would probably have a different opinion on what the greatest record of all time is anyways. Hard question to answer!
Were you obliged to give just one album to extraterrestrials that would represent the whole human music, which album would it be and from which band/artist?
T: Depends whether they from a threat or not. If so, I would give them Decapitated’s “Organic Hallucinosis”, just so they know not to fuck with us humans. But if they would be a peaceful species who I’d want to impress, I’d probably give them “Suite Begamasque” by Claude Debussy.
Imagine that your girlfriend is selling your whole album-collection just to buy an expensive ring for herself. How would you react?
T: If I ever manage to get a girlfriend like that, then shame on me! Having said that, my album-collection is not that impressive anyways… haha…
I think we’re done Tymon… Close this interview in your way… Take care!
T: Thanks for the support and the interesting questions! And to everyone reading this, hope to see you guys out on the road soon. Cheers!